What are You Baking the Week of July 12, 2020?

[Mike Nolan]

Looks like our old friend the missing page link is back.

[Joan Simpson]

Yes BakerAunt you have a wonderful husband,nice!

I baked two loaves of banana bread tonight will give one to my sister-in-law in the morning.We sit on the porch every morning for coffee.

[Joan Simpson]

Mike I had to go to general discussions to be able to past.

[Mike Nolan]

Yeah, it kind of gets lost.

I may have to try Bakeraunt's soudough cheese cracker recipe with some of my rye sourdough discard, but I've only been making 150 grams of it at a time, so I'd probably have at most about a half cup of discard.

[chocomouse]

Today I made bagels. I couldn't find my favorite, marked up recipe, so tried a new one. Something is very wrong, I won't be using that one again!!

[Mike Nolan]

The bagel recipes I use the most often are the ones in The Bread Baker's Apprentice and in Artisan Breads Every Day. The ABED one makes a smaller batch of dough, which is why I use it the most.

I've used a couple of others. I did find one that had too much salt in it, I wonder what the issue is with the one you used today?

[aaronatthedoublef]

Choco, there must be some way to salvage them even if they aren't bagels.

I have BA's KAF sourdough crackers in the oven.

What kind of flour do you use for bagels? Do I really need high gluten or will bread flour do?

Thanks

[chocomouse]

I really don't have a clue about what went wrong with these bagels -- I must have not measured correctly or skipped something. But the recipe is so simple, that would be difficult, and I have made this recipe before. I have not cut into the bagels yet, but will certainly at least try eating one. I think the dough was a little wetter than my usual bagel dough, and a little lighter. I let the dough balls rest for 25 minutes, and they puffed slightly. Then I shaped them (poked a hole) and set them aside while I did the rest of them. They rose quite a bit, and quickly. It was a warm day, mid-70-80 in my kitchen. I boiled them 4 at a time, 2 minutes on the first side, 1 minute on the second side (not using a timer, just estimating). They looked fine, although still obviously "risen". Put them on a baking sheet and baked for 25 minutes. They came out all shriveled up, wrinkly. They are flat, half the size as they were when they went into the oven. And flatter than any bagel I've ever made. I think the problem is 1. they rose, a lot (in hindsight, I recall about double in size) 2. They shriveled I'm not going to obsess over this, I'll just try again, or not. I have another recipe I often use, and so far that one is fine.

Aaron, I don't like a really chewy bagel (want to save my teeth!). So I use 2 cups of bread flour and 2 cups of AP. I sometimes use 1-2 cups of whole wheat. I do use KAF AP, which is higher in gluten, more comparable to bread flour.

Mike, I've used the bagel recipes in both the BBA and ABED; they're fine recipes too. Some days, I just like trying different recipes, other days I stick with something I know works.

[KIDPIZZA]

CHOCOMOUSE:
Good Morning to you. I read your post with much interest. I am sorry you suffered a big disapointment today with them.
My friend, I hope you do not mind if I mention to you a few baking science tid-bits that will help your results in lean baking bread products.

My opinion why your bagel baking resulted in "WRINKLED-UP/SHRIVLED UP" is because your dough was not fully development.... enough to provide the baked article with max "GLUTEN DEVELOPMENT" to form properly during baking.
It takes a full 10 min. of agitation in a typical KA mixer, others types 9 min. would suffice.

As you know, the point of boiling the BAGELS prior to baking is to "STOP THE RISING DUE TO THE FUNCYIONING OF THE YEAST" Yeast is murdered at 139 degrees. Soooo, it best you can consider boiling 1.5 min. per side.

As Mike mentioned in another post KAF AP flour is a XLNT subst. for bagels & pizza as well as it is low level bread flour. I do think that HI- G flour is of choice in bagel baking however

I enjoyed spending some quality time with you this morning...I hope I was able to help you today. Good luck in your baking & STAY WELL.

~KIDPIZZA....CASS.

[Mike Nolan]

I have used everything from very high protein (> 15%) flour to Gold Medal AP (under 11%) for bagels with no problems.

Personally, I feel boiling bagels longer than 30-40 seconds per side is a mistake. I may have to make a batch of plain bagels with different times in the water to see what happens.

I will disagree with Cass a bit on the science behind boiling bagels, though, I think it is to gelatinize the surface starch, which is part of what produces the shiny surface of a classic bagel. The inner part of the bagel doesn't get hot enough in the boiling water to kill the yeast there, though the yeast towards the surface will die.

There was an interesting discussion in the BBGA forum a couple months back on whether or not an alkali bath is needed for bagels. To say opinions varied would be an understatement! Those that don't use an alkali bath generally use a bath with sugar, honey or malt syrup in it.

[BakerAunt]

It's always a treat to see a post from Cass!

On Thursday, I baked the Crispy Rye and Seed Crackers (Peter Reinhart recipe), from the dough I made Monday evening. I used whole egg for the egg wash, rather than egg white, because I had it available. I topped with sesame seed. (I pressed them into the dough by putting waxed paper on top and pushing down with my hands.) I rolled it out on parchment, with saran over the top to 28 x 24 cm. I cut them into 4 x4 cm squares. I pulled them apart so that they were spaced away from each other on the parchment. I used the convection setting of 275F and the third rack up in my oven (slightly above halfway). I initially did half the dough and baked a single sheet at a time for 25 minutes, switching the sheet around halfway through. After lunch, I baked the other two, also separately, but I cut the baking time to 24 minutes. After the crackers were done, I removed the parchment and let them cool on the hot baking sheet.

These are certainly crispy. They are not bad, but they do not wow me in a way that makes me see a need to bake them again. I cut down the time on the second batch with the idea that maybe they baked a bit too long, even though they are not burned. I think that the taste is marginally better, but it is still not what I would like. It may be that it would have been better just to use the egg white for the wash, although I’ve used whole egg for crisp bread with no issue. It may also be that the crackers would be better with dark rye flour, which would give them more flavor. My husband says they are not bad, but I suspect that he will be glad when I make another batch of the cheese crackers next week.

[Mike Nolan]

I did make a batch of bagels today, using the ABED recipe. 3 of them were boiled for 30 seconds on each side, 3 of them for 1 1/2 minutes on each side and 3 of them for 3 minutes on each side. The poaching liquid had honey in it but no baking soda or salt.

I'm posting pictures below and will discuss texture and flavor after we have some of the bagels for supper.

The first picture is the bagels after shaping but before being boiled.

The second picture is after the bagels have been boiled.

The third picture is after baking.

Can you guess which column of bagels was boiled for 30 seconds, for 90 seconds and for 180 seconds per side?

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[Mike Nolan]

We shared one of the 3 minute bagels and one of the 30 second bagels for supper.

The first picture is the bagel that was boiled for 30 seconds:

The second picture is the bagel that was boiled for 3 minutes:

In my previous post, the bagels on the right were the 30 second ones, the ones in the middle were the 90 second ones and the ones on the left were the 180 second (3 minute) ones.

The 90 second ones and the 3 minute ones puffed up a lot more during boiling, but by the time they were baked the size differences were less obvious. The longer they boiled the softer they feel to the touch, and I think that may have impacted interior texture and color a bit though the distinct difference in color in the above photos could be caused by my camera. I should have taken a shot of them side by side. Maybe next meal. Because I used barley malt syrup, which is dark brown, my bagels always have some color in the interior. The 3 minute one was harder to cut because of the softness and the exterior is less smooth and shiny.

My wife thought the 30 second bagel had a bit more flavor from the poaching liquid but thought the 3 minute one 'tasted more like a bagel'. I thought the 30 second was was better than the 3 minute one in all respects, including chewiness.

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[Italiancook]

I tried jennycancook.com's recipe for Sesame Hamburger Buns, because I wanted the buns in a hurry. They have only one rise. I took a picture of the dough to send to friends. Took another of the shaped buns before proofing to send. In the process of being enthralled with my ability to use my cell phone for this, I forgot the instruction to flatten the dough balls before covering. So when I sent the finished product photos, I had to explain the mistake by calling them bacce balls. They were high and beautifully round on top from the oven rise. We had them with hamburgers anyhow, and they were fine. I would have liked more flavor, but they were tender, and that's how I like hamburger buns. They're made with oil, but if I make again, I'll use butter even though it's only 2 tablespoons.

[Joan Simpson]

Your bagels look good Mike.

Italiancook I've tried several recipes from jennycancook and have liked them,your hamburger buns sound well also!

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