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[Mike Nolan]

I've been making the Roman crust (or a variant on it) for a while, I'm still not completely satisfied with it. I'm looking for a crisper crust. Maybe I need to play around with baking time/temp more?

[BakerAunt]

Here is my report. Alas, there were no holes, but the rolls are delicious.

I took the rolls out of the refrigerator 20 minutes before baking. To turn the rolls over, I used a small silicone spatula lightly coated with cooking spray. These rolls held their shape much better than in my first attempt last October. I am convinced that bread flour is important for that. However, I did not see much indication of the impression when I turned them. Once I put them in the oven, some of the lines were clearer, but as with last time, there were no standouts. Baking time is 10-15 minutes at 500F, until they are “the color of sand,” which is not a helpful description. I baked for 11 minutes until some browning appeared on the tops.

We waited the recommended 15 minutes, then sat down to dinner. We used them for sandwiches with warmed up leftover boneless pork chops. I had one, and my husband had two. Alas, the famous hole was not there in any of these rolls. However, the taste and texture is as wonderful as I remember it: the interior is soft, with a chewy crust.

What will I change next time? I will use two baking sheets and bake them separately, six to a pan, as a couple slightly baked into the ones next to them. That would put them two inches apart, as the recipe specifies. I am wondering if I should consider using some high gluten flour.

I think, however, that there must be a technique to forming the balls of dough and using the stamp that I have not yet discovered. Daniel Leader, whose recipe I am following, says, “round each piece into a tight ball (see Shaping Rolls, p. 37). Stamp each piece with the roll stamp.” Cass sent me a xerox of the recipe, as the book, Local Breads is out of print, but that is pages 226-229. I have no idea what is on p. 37, and if it is the standard roll shaping. Leader says that “a combination of steam and heat inflates the small rounds of dough and creates an air pocket in the center.

I could try baking with the convection setting, maybe at 475F? By the way, when I took out the rolls, it set off the smoke detector in the dining area. Next time, I will turn on the stove hood fan to prevent it; the poor dog streaked up the stairs at the high-pitched sound.

[Mike Nolan]

Can you post a picture of the stamp you have?

Here's one of the views my son sent me of the stamp he's working on, modeled on a photo of a metal one I sent him. The challenge is the handle, you either have to use a lot of dissolving material or make two pieces and put them together somehow. He was working on making the cones smaller at the center.

The recipe in Italian in that old thread is one I tried several times, but without a stamp I never got anything close to a hollow center. (I tried ice cubes in the middle, butter in the middle and a few other ideas.) The rolls were delicious even without a hollow center

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[BakerAunt]

After 13 ½ hours, I removed the biga and put it in a bowl. I added the water, per the directions. I found it difficult to break up the biga into the water with the rubber spatula. I wonder if it would be easier to break it up before adding the water, or if it would still be a problem. I did manage to get most of the water incorporated, and to get the dough into globs. I put it into the bread machine, then added the remaining ingredients on top and let the dough cycle do the mixing and kneading. I then moved it to a 2-qt. oiled container for 40 minutes. (Room temperature 70F) That resting time was closer to 55 minutes, as I did not have my shaping area set up.

My husband became unexpectedly chatty about this time, and I finally had to tell him that I could not concentrate on the task at hand and carry on a conversation. (That is one of the failings of the open concept kitchen.) He decided to go work in the shed.

The dough was very slack but easier to work with than last time. Once I folded it over, I was able to shape it into a rough rectangle 24x18 cm. After I cut it into four on the long 24 side, it was closer to 21cm wide, so I cut it into threes the other way. I pulled the pieces apart. They need to be set far apart from each other, or they will spread out and into each other while the baker shapes them one at a time. I had them on a silicone mat. I shaped each roll by folding it in on the bottom, then rolling it with the flat of my hand before cupping my fingers around it to make the smooth ball. Mindful of the problems I had last time when transferring the stamped rolls, I sprayed a wide silicone spatula with cooking spray, wiped it with a paper towel, then sprayed the stamp with the cooking spray and wiped it. That made it easy for the stamp to separate from the dough and for me to flip the stamped roll onto a floured baking sheet. I had to reapply the spray on the stamp and wipe it every four rolls. I wiped the silicone spatula with the paper towel with spray after each time. I decided to use a USA half-sheet pan this time rather than my rimless pan to keep the flour off the oven floor once I bake. These may be a bit too close together, but I only realized that after I had them on the pan. Next time, I may use two USA half-sheet pans. I put the pan, covered with lightly sprayed saran into the refrigerator. The rolls rest there for at least 3 hours and up to 8 hours. I plan to bake them after 3 ½ hours.

Last time, I baked them on the third rack up. I am going to try the second rack this time.

[BakerAunt]

I first attempted Rosetta Rolls the fourth week of October 2020, and I wrote about it in that thread. However, these are tricky enough that I want to give them their own thread, so I am doing so for this second attempt.

I mixed up the Biga on Thursday, May 27 at 8:45 p.m. This time, I put it in the 4-qt. dough bucket. After an hour, I refrigerated it overnight. I used only Bob’s Red Mill Artisan Bread flour. (The recipe calls for bread flour, preferably high gluten.) The temperature in the house was 75F. The rise in the first hour was not as dramatic as when I used half of the BRM and half KA AP, but it was still strong. Overnight, the biga stayed right at the 2-qt. line.

[BakerAunt]

Thanks, CWCdesign. I wonder why the customer service person who responded to my email did not tell me that. The person was not particularly knowledgeable, as her suggestions on where to look for barley flour were useless. (Thank heavens for S. Wirth who pointed me to Walmart.com) She did send me some coupons I could use on other BRM items.

BRM is moving toward some prepared foods. It started with some snack bars, and they have now moved on to oat crackers. I was able to taste free samples of the plain ones and the rosemary one. They are very good, but they are also overly salty.

[Mike Nolan]

An interesting article, not enough pictures, though, and it doesn't answer the question of how to make a honey-stuffed challah.

Idan (ChallahPrince) has some really complicated braids on his Instagram page. I asked him the question about the 6 strand braid in The Deli Man, he agrees with Jeff Hamelman that it is the same as the classic 6 strand braid, but admits that the way it is done looks totally different and weird, he calls it a 'baker thing'.

[BakerAunt]

For dinner on Wednesday, I made the Quinoa Summer Salad from the Penzey’s website. I reduce the oil from ½ to 1/3 cup, and I use Penzey’s Sandwich Sprinkle as the seasoning. I also add 5 oz. feta. My husband pan cooked boneless pork chops. (He may not grill like Chocomouses' husband, but hey, I accept his contribution!) We have plenty of leftovers for the next few dinners.

I also made another batch of yogurt.

[cwcdesign]

Michael used to be the griller at our house, but when he got sick mid aughts, I had to take over or we wouldn't have anything grilled. Fortunately, he recovered and continued to grill until we lost him. When we moved here, I really wanted a grill, so my boys gave me a smaller Weber gas grill (that's what we always had) a Spirit E-210. It's just the right size for the patio. I still grill, but Will has taken to it like a fish to water. Although we would grill year round in Massachusetts. it's nice to have warmer temperatures all year for that. But, I still hate the heat in the summer.

[Mike Nolan]

Swordfish is quite a bit fattier than tuna, that affects cooking methods. I've ordered it in restaurants on the coast, was never really excited by it. I'm not sure if any of the local 'fresh' (often actually frozen and thawed) fish outlets have it.

[BakerAunt]

Janiebakes--Cass (Kid Pizza) called me yesterday, and he asked if there were any new members at Nebraska Kitchen. I mentioned that you had joined us and were previously on the Baking Circle. He was thrilled to hear that you have joined the group, as he remembers you from the Baking Circle. He asked that I send you his good wishes.

[chocomouse]

BakerAunt, you should try fresh tuna also. It has a nice firm flesh, but the flavor is a bit stronger than the usual white fish. When we travel to Michigan every summer (and YES, the trip is a go this year!) we always visit a small deli in Saugatuk to get their smoked white fish - it's a real treat. It doesn't need to be cooked, and is delicious added to a salad. I've never seen it in any other markets.

[chocomouse]

Luckily, my husband is a master at grilling. I don't know how to even turn on the grill, and 40 years ago I said I had no intention of learning!! He has a gas grill and a pellet smoker, and runs them off his Apple iWatch, while he sits inside with a gin and tonic. He grills outside all year round, (he has shoveled a path through 2 feet of snow on the deck) and can cook anything, from meats to veggies to pizza. And it is rare that anything isn't perfectly cooked. As I said, I'm so lucky!

[Mike Nolan]

I'm not very experienced at grilling, either, I can do a steak but it is easier for me to pan fry it and finish it in the oven. I do burgers on the grill, and I like to do chicken or turkey using the rotisserie.

Our grill is about 24 years old and one of the gas controls no longer works, we'll have to replace it at some point (nobody does repairs on grills anymore), I think I used it less than a dozen times all summer last year, mostly for burgers, somehow it doesn't seem worthwhile to spend $1000+ on a fancy new grill, and the smaller ones generally don't have rotisseries these days.

[Mike Nolan]

Swai would probably be a good fish done en papillote (in a parchment bag), I've usually cooked whitefish with lemon, but I've also used white wine or rice wine vinegar and even Worcestershire, and it is good done on a bed of cooked mirepoix (finely chopped onions, celery and carrots,or you can leave the onions out, it'd also be good with some red bell pepper.)

The frozen orange roughy we can get are OK, the fresh ones are better but a lot more expensive. I like red snapper, but Diane doesn't. I seldom buy cod and won't buy tilapia any more.

I grew up within a few miles of the Mississippi, catfish was pretty common, but also bluegill. My mother loved smelt, probably because there wasn't much to preparing it.

I'm not surprised your husband thought the swai tasted like catfish, it used to be sold as 'Asian catfish' before the US Government prohibited that.