Forum Replies Created
-
AuthorPosts
-
Here is the Vollrath pan I am considering:
It weighs 1 lbs, while the one in your link weighs 2.2 lbs., even though the description on the 2.2 lb. says that it is 18 gauge. The one in your link is also a bit larger.
This is one of those times when I wish that I could hold the pan in my hands.
Thanks, Mike. I checked, and they do not have that size. I did some googling and find that a 2/3 sheet pan seems to be the size that is being sold. (15x21). I note that it also comes in different gauges, and the higher the number (and thinner the sheet), the cheaper it is. I want a heavier baking sheet, like the large flat Vollrath ones I own. Those came from the cooking.com site that was bought by some other company and cannibalized. (I miss them.)
Webresraurant has one for $7.88, but it is 18 gauge.
Amazon has a 15x21 for $15.81. The description does not specify, but a reviewer comments that it is 10 gauge.
My experience is that heavier pans bake better with less overbrowning on the bottom.
Maybe "so much work" is not the correct phrase. The rolls have two long resting periods, so working out the timing Is the tricky part. I need to be sure that I have two consecutive days when I can do what the rolls need, when they need it, even though it is not a lot of hands-on time. The bread machine doing the kneading is a big help.
I suspect the pasta machine the poster used, and the way he made up his balls probably adds at least 90 minutes direct hands-on time, and that does not include setting up and cleaning the pasta machine (and I do not have a pasta machine).
Dinner on Sunday was stir-fry using the remaining leftover boneless pork chops, buckwheat noodles, carrots, celery, green onion, red bell pepper, mushrooms, broccoli, and the drippings I deglazed from when the pork was cooked. I decided to cut the carrots on the diagonal this time instead of in sticks. We like how they cooked, and since it is less work, I will cut them that way in the future.
Here is what Leader says: Italian bakers are judged on the size of the hollow (my best rolls have had air pockets the size of a golfball" [sic]).
He also says it is a "very stiff, extremely active dough." Certainly the BRM artisan bread flour made for a more manageable dough than half KABC AP and half the BRM artisan bread flour, although I would not necessarily call it stiff.
He does specify "unbleached bread flour preferably high-gluten." I am wondering about trying the KABC high-gluten flour.
Thanks for sharing the post and pictures, Janiebakes. Somehow, those rolls do not look like what I was expecting. I anticipate a "hole" but not that the entire roll would be empty. These rolls are so much work that if I had to add a pasta machine to roll them out, then I would resign myself to not having the holes and just enjoying them as they are.
The part of the post that I will think about is the need for a taut dough ball. This dough is VERY springy, and the instructions say nothing about degassing it thoroughly, just pat into a rough rectangle and divide into 12 pieces. It may be that the rolls do not retain the print because the dough is so springy.
That was WAY too much marjoram, Italian Cook. My pea soup recipe only calls for 1/4 tsp. (makes about 8 cups), and I can just taste it, along with the 1/2 tsp. thyme. Just that tiny amount adds to the soup, and I would miss it without, but more would overpower it.
It turns out that posting a picture may take a while, as I will need to figure out how to get it off the camera now that the software that came with the camera no longer works with the current Windows. (Clearly, I have been remiss in actually doing anything with all the pictures on the camera, as I am only just discovering this fact.) My husband and I will work on it--we might get lucky even though neither of us is techy--otherwise, my elder stepson is coming for a visit in June, and he probably knows what to do.
We had warmed leftover boneless pork chops on Rosetta buns and leftover quinoa salad.
Mike, I took some pictures of the stamp. I will see if I can figure out how to post them.
Here is my report. Alas, there were no holes, but the rolls are delicious.
I took the rolls out of the refrigerator 20 minutes before baking. To turn the rolls over, I used a small silicone spatula lightly coated with cooking spray. These rolls held their shape much better than in my first attempt last October. I am convinced that bread flour is important for that. However, I did not see much indication of the impression when I turned them. Once I put them in the oven, some of the lines were clearer, but as with last time, there were no standouts. Baking time is 10-15 minutes at 500F, until they are “the color of sand,” which is not a helpful description. I baked for 11 minutes until some browning appeared on the tops.
We waited the recommended 15 minutes, then sat down to dinner. We used them for sandwiches with warmed up leftover boneless pork chops. I had one, and my husband had two. Alas, the famous hole was not there in any of these rolls. However, the taste and texture is as wonderful as I remember it: the interior is soft, with a chewy crust.
What will I change next time? I will use two baking sheets and bake them separately, six to a pan, as a couple slightly baked into the ones next to them. That would put them two inches apart, as the recipe specifies. I am wondering if I should consider using some high gluten flour.
I think, however, that there must be a technique to forming the balls of dough and using the stamp that I have not yet discovered. Daniel Leader, whose recipe I am following, says, “round each piece into a tight ball (see Shaping Rolls, p. 37). Stamp each piece with the roll stamp.” Cass sent me a xerox of the recipe, as the book, Local Breads is out of print, but that is pages 226-229. I have no idea what is on p. 37, and if it is the standard roll shaping. Leader says that “a combination of steam and heat inflates the small rounds of dough and creates an air pocket in the center.
I could try baking with the convection setting, maybe at 475F? By the way, when I took out the rolls, it set off the smoke detector in the dining area. Next time, I will turn on the stove hood fan to prevent it; the poor dog streaked up the stairs at the high-pitched sound.
Janiebakes--That thread was saved and is here at Nebraska Kitchen:
My Rosetta Stamp was gifted to me by Cass, along with a xerox of the recipe from a Daniel Leader bread book that is out of print. I promised him that I would work to perfect the recipe and report my results to him. I decided also to post about it here.
Cass recalls these rolls from his childhood. His mother would buy them and make egg, onion, and pepper sandwiches which they would eat at the seaside. He says that the salt air added special flavor.
When I baked them in October, I produced delicious rolls, but they did not have the "hole" the stamp is supposed to produce. I would bake them just for the flavor, but I would like to figure out how to use the stamp so that the hole appears. If I achieve that, there will be pictures posted.!
After 13 ½ hours, I removed the biga and put it in a bowl. I added the water, per the directions. I found it difficult to break up the biga into the water with the rubber spatula. I wonder if it would be easier to break it up before adding the water, or if it would still be a problem. I did manage to get most of the water incorporated, and to get the dough into globs. I put it into the bread machine, then added the remaining ingredients on top and let the dough cycle do the mixing and kneading. I then moved it to a 2-qt. oiled container for 40 minutes. (Room temperature 70F) That resting time was closer to 55 minutes, as I did not have my shaping area set up.
My husband became unexpectedly chatty about this time, and I finally had to tell him that I could not concentrate on the task at hand and carry on a conversation. (That is one of the failings of the open concept kitchen.) He decided to go work in the shed.
The dough was very slack but easier to work with than last time. Once I folded it over, I was able to shape it into a rough rectangle 24x18 cm. After I cut it into four on the long 24 side, it was closer to 21cm wide, so I cut it into threes the other way. I pulled the pieces apart. They need to be set far apart from each other, or they will spread out and into each other while the baker shapes them one at a time. I had them on a silicone mat. I shaped each roll by folding it in on the bottom, then rolling it with the flat of my hand before cupping my fingers around it to make the smooth ball. Mindful of the problems I had last time when transferring the stamped rolls, I sprayed a wide silicone spatula with cooking spray, wiped it with a paper towel, then sprayed the stamp with the cooking spray and wiped it. That made it easy for the stamp to separate from the dough and for me to flip the stamped roll onto a floured baking sheet. I had to reapply the spray on the stamp and wipe it every four rolls. I wiped the silicone spatula with the paper towel with spray after each time. I decided to use a USA half-sheet pan this time rather than my rimless pan to keep the flour off the oven floor once I bake. These may be a bit too close together, but I only realized that after I had them on the pan. Next time, I may use two USA half-sheet pans. I put the pan, covered with lightly sprayed saran into the refrigerator. The rolls rest there for at least 3 hours and up to 8 hours. I plan to bake them after 3 ½ hours.
Last time, I baked them on the third rack up. I am going to try the second rack this time.
The Key Lime tarts came out well but are exceptionally tart. I attribute that to my husband's not picking them until they had turned yellowish. To my surprise, my husband also ate one at lunch, so he will remember not to let them go so long next time. When I serve remaining ones, I will top each with a small scoop of low-fat vanilla yogurt to balance the tartness.
On Thursday evening I made the biga for Rosetta Rolls. I read over my notes from my first attempt in October and the suggestions people at Nebraska Kitchen gave me, along with some thoughts that Cass had at the time. Last time I used half Bob's Red Mill Artisan Bread flour and half King Arthur AP. This time, I am using all BRM Artisan bread flour.
-
AuthorPosts
