[aaronatthedoublef]

Thanks Mike. I appreciate that. And I get the mixing of different wheats and holding wheat back to try for consistency. I have a buddy who worked in IT for Pepsi and he used to talk about the huge vats of orange juice (I think Pepsi owns or owned Tropicana) to try and keep the taste consistent not just for a year but over 10 years.

When I was looking at Mark Bittman's cookbook he uses "hard" and "soft" to signify higher gluten flours like bread and higher or softer flours like cake (he does not mention pastry). I've only heard hard and soft in terms of wheat and never read it used like Mr. Bittman does.

And speaking of hard and soft wheat I like KAB's soft white wheat mostly for the flavor but it is crazy expensive here. I can buy a hard white wheat from Central Milling for less even with shipping. Is what give KAB's a mellower flavor the fact that it is white, not red or that it is soft and not hard like their red whole wheat?

[aaronatthedoublef]

I made ciabatta dough an used it for pizza. Thumbs up from both Kate and Violet. I tried to take it out of the pan for the last of the bake and made an awful mess but that did not slow anyone down from eating it. It was definitely over-proofed which didn't help. I'll try again either next week or the week after.

CWC, I've had a number of really solid professional bakers tell me that I can use AP or bread flour interchangeably. I haven't used AP in a few decades at this point subbing in bread flour. But then again I know bakers who won't use KAB's bread flour to sub for Sir Galahad even though they are supposed to be from the same line. So who knows...

I need a good source on flour that will guide me through terms like "high extraction" and "strong" and the like.

[aaronatthedoublef]

Thanks. I looked at some more recipes and he has a few that use a tea towel for the first rise but most are in the mixing bowl. Lahey really wants his bread to be accessible. I like his cookbook as much for the story as for the recipes. He went to Italy to study sculpting and came back a baker.

The thing I don't like is while he considers the cost of pots and pans and bakers he recommends he does not consider storage.

[aaronatthedoublef]

One more note - Lahey's loaves don't take any longer, they just take less fussing. At Uncle Matt's I'd start with an autolyze which was 1-2 hours. Then mix everything together. Then stretch and fold three or four times at 30 minute intervals. Then preliminary shaping and first rise, then final shaping and second rise which was overnight in the walk-in. Someone would come in at 3 am, take the overnight out and let it come to temp then put it on the peels, slash it, and put it in the oven.

So except for the ciabatta all Matt's loaves take about 24 hours from start to finish.

[aaronatthedoublef]

Mike, do you cook your apple pie filling before you freeze it? Does it break down the apples at all and change the texture?

What does everyone use in their apple pie filling? So far I use cinnamon and some sugar. Sometime I add ginger.

Lahey does not call for raising dough on a towel in his book. First rise is always in the bowl for 12-18 hours. I think this is probably easier for most people and, as Mike says, the water is absorbed into the flour, some probably evaporates off, and it is easier to handle.

I did my first raise in a greased baking bag in a measured dough bucket. Second rise for Lahey is "in a warm, dry place" covered with a towel. I put it on a floured cutting board and covered it with plastic wrap and a tea towel over that.

This will be good for rolls and I may try it for pizza too.

I'm not a big Bittman fan. Someone gave me his "How To Cook Everything" and I still prefer the "Joy of Cooking"

[aaronatthedoublef]

Pictures of my ciabatta. You can see the one I started to round has a huge cavity. I should have either done a real round or shaped it back like the other one. Violet gave taste a thumbs up. Kate hasn't tried it yet.

I did not do this in a clay baker like the book suggests. I baked it right on the stone and spritzed water into the oven. I don't have Nolan-nater Steamer yet.

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[aaronatthedoublef]

Joan, I'm interested in your one layer cake. What pan did you bake it in.

I made ciabatta. I used the Sullivan Street recipe. It is the wettest dough I've ever made - about 88%. Still handles really nicely and requires little shaping so that was easy. Still baking now.

If I like it I may make another batch for pizza night. What people emphasis about Jim Lahey is no-knead but his really point is a low-fuss method without lots of equipment and stretching and multiple shaping.

He does, however use lots of pots because his method uses really wet dough without all the stretching. I'm going to try some more recipes.

[aaronatthedoublef]

You make galette sound easy! It looks great. My recipes make it sound so complicated. Or maybe it is the French name. I wonder if my wife would like it as an alternative to pie. Kate does not like pies. Could be done for custard pies. What if you lightly baked the custard just enough to set so it wouldn't run out then put it in the crust and baked it all to finish.

Thanks for the tips on grilling.

Anyone have recommendations on an induction cook top? And will porcelain coated cast iron work on it? I know the cast iron part is good I just don't know if the porcelain gets in the way.

[aaronatthedoublef]

Congrats Mike. It is a good article. How does the oven door not block the tubing?

[aaronatthedoublef]

Mike - I just checked my KAB bags and they do not tell the thickness. They are thicker than samples I've received from other places so I would guess they are closer to 1 m. Thanks for the tip.

BA - I used to wrap bread in plastic wrap first but I don't anymore. I do that with cakes and scones but not bread.

I put desiccant packs in my bread bags to absorb some of the moisture.
I also save twist ties to close the bags.

[aaronatthedoublef]

I don't think Uno's actually used it. I think it was one pizza maker trashing talking another. The restaurateurs I know around here are major, major trash talkers. They make the worst NBA players look like grade school kids.

But, when someone needs help they are the first people there pitching in.

I need to try grilled pizza sometime before the cold arrives.

[aaronatthedoublef]

Thanks. I'll check out International Plastics.

Am I the only one who re-uses bread bags? I use turkey-size roasting bags to raise dough, especially in the final proof and I've used those over and over.

[aaronatthedoublef]

Thanks Mike and BA. I need an alternative source for bags other than KAB. Clear bags is okay but I couldn't find regular, plastic bread bags like I buy from KAB.

BA - why aren't regular, plastic bread bags reusable? I do it. My mom did it with the bread she bought from the grocery store. Not sure why you need a special bag to reuse it.

[aaronatthedoublef]

I tried something new last night. I thought we were having seven for pizza so I pulled biscuit dough out of the freezer to use as a crust. I pressed it out into a quarter sheet, sauce, and TJ's mozzarella. It was tasty. Violet likes it better than the yeast crust. It is so much easier but much worse in food contents. My yeast crust is lean with about 60% whole grains.

I oiled the quarter sheet (I could have used WAY less) then finished it on the stone. I should have put it onto the stone sooner. I will not make this a weekly offering but I told Kate I need to try some new things. I think next week I'll try ciabatta crust.

The idea came from three places, first, I thought we would have more people so I needed emergency crust! As it turned out we only had three people. Next, I have used pie crust for pizza by accident before I began labeling things in the freezer. Finally, many years ago, someone started a rumor that Uno's - the original before it became the big chain - used Pop 'n Fresh biscuit dough for its crusts.

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[aaronatthedoublef]

I made potato rolls. I'd started with the KAF recipe but it seemed to stiff so this time I upped the hydration to 70% and I'm very happy with the outcome. I may brush the top with egg wash next time to give them some more color.

I was going to make challah but we were out of eggs and by the time I went to the store I'd lost the momentum. I may make it out of cycle. I usually prep it Thursday night or Friday morning. I'm still adjusting to the morning schedule after school started. I make the breakfasts and lunches and get our kids on the bus.

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