[aaronatthedoublef]

Thanks Mike. I had to make this divided because the biggest bowl I have is 8 qts which will only make about 9 lbs of dough. I made two batches of about 7.5lbs each and put it in two buckets which each hold about 8-9lbs of dough. So I already did that out of necessity. But, next time, if I understand correctly, I'll do one big batch at the mix (I just ordered a 20qt bowl), divide it, then shape one batch and preheat the oven while rising, then shape the second batch. I like doing it all at once for the assembly line aspect. Do one task, finish, and move on to the next. If our second oven were working I could bake eight loaves at once but...

As for speed racks, that would be great but it would never be tolerated. Our kitchen is for show not for go.

[aaronatthedoublef]

BA - I have an old KA from before they were acquired by Whirlpool. It smells like burning plastic whenever I use it which is why Kate bought me a new one (the "new one" is about 17 years old). But it still works. It just stinks.

The burning smell started mixing a stiff bread dough at a higher speed. I suspect it would have been okay had I just used a low speed. But that is one of the reasons I started making bread dough by hand. With KAs, anything smaller than an eight quart seems to be too small for all but the smallest recipes and the dough runs up over the hook even if the motor is okay.

[aaronatthedoublef]

I am doing research now of gophers and peanut butter. I do know the exterminator had me bait our mouse traps with it, so it may be the sort of thing where the peanut butter attracts the gopher and then something else kills it.

Busy end of week baking. Thursday I made the dough for 14 loaves of challah and put it to rise in the basement fridge. It took my two biggest bowls and two rising buckets. It was a lot of dough! Violet and I also made "coconut" cake for Kate for her birthday which was pretty un-coconutty. I tried something new after my last one. I had a good recipe but somehow I lost it so I am back on the hunt. This was basically a white cake subbing coconut cream for the milk. It called for five egg whites and one egg. I used two eggs and four whites to give it a little more structure.

Then I was up at 2 Friday morning to shape and bake and make Kate birthday scones. After the initial shaping I put together the scone ingredients.

I went from four strands to three because it takes less time but I may switch back at some point. I braided the challahs (technically it is challot) and put them aside to rise. I mixed, shaped, and baked the scones while the challahs were rising.

I can bake four loaves at a time because one of our ovens is broken. I think some of my loaves might have been a bit overproofed waiting to bake. But they looked good, smelled good, and tasted good.

By 5:45 I had a dozen scones cooling and 14 loaves of bread!

Friday afternoon Violet and I decorated Kate's cake which tasted good and looked good too which is unusual for our cakes.

I still need to make sandwich bread for next week but I am not sure when I will do that as we have stuff this weekend.

[aaronatthedoublef]

I just realized, this might work for Henry but Violet will not eat my pizza cold or even reheated. She will eat the junk pizza or pizza bagels but not mine.

Spinach and ricotta sounds good. I may tried this just for regular pizza night. Two of the three kids will not try it as long as they know what it is.

Henry might if he doesn't... He was eating a Ruben the other day and I said "When did you start liking rye bread." Hen replied "I'm pretty sure this isn't rye." I said, "it is marble rye."

Now in fairness, it was probably some store brand so it was a little bland but, it sure was rye!

Kids!

[aaronatthedoublef]

Thanks BA. Thanks Mike.

Working with two bakers here I was amazed at the small amount of starter they used for relatively large amounts of dough. I think most of the recipes for home bakers I've seen use a much bigger ratio. One of the things I noticed about the Unified Mills recipe is the relatively small amount of starter added to the levain compared to my standard recipe.

The other thing is, bakers NEVER EVER through away ANYTHING unless it is a health hazard. Margins are small and tossing something that is useable or saleable - even as a sample - can affect the bottom line. Even giving out samples, while free, is still marketing and generates good will.

When Sam was home and I was making about 8 lbs of bread a week AND BA's crackers, I did not need to worry about discard! I may try starter chocolate chip cookies. I've heard so many raves about those.

And part of the "put started in everything" movement probably comes from not wanting to waste it and also the belief that starter has beneficial bacteria for the gut. I agree with the former. I am not sure how about the latter. Way more research needs to be done on that.

[aaronatthedoublef]

Thanks BA. I've seen some similar recipes but I do not recall where. Someone was repurposing cinnamon buns to make pizza rolls.

This might be the next thing in pizza. It would be good for school lunches too.

[aaronatthedoublef]

Is yogurt the new way for home bakers to make starter-less "sourdough"?

It's in the recipe Mike and I tested. It's in one of these instead of a levain.

As for self-rising flour there seem to be more and more recipes counting it as one ingredient. Is a box of cake mix one ingredient? Just add water and it is a two ingredient recipe!

[aaronatthedoublef]

Mike,

I noticed it being slack as well. I used a levain.

My boule stuck to the towel it was so wet and I didn't flour it enough.

I should have reshaped it but just dumped it onto the stone.

Taste became a little sour after a couple days. Boules may be easier to shape than batards and boules are what you have with Dutch ovens. So that may be why they did that.

[aaronatthedoublef]

BA - is there a noticeable difference between the BRM and the KAB milk powder? Thanks

[aaronatthedoublef]

Finally came around to baking bread yesterday. We were down to one ciabatta roll. I am trying something different with my standard starter loaf. I've been trying to tame the sour by changing the taste of the starter - if I skip a feeding and keep it cool it is sweeter. But then I just reduced the amount of starter and replaced it with some water. I haven't tried the bread yet as I went from making bread to making pizza last night so I'll cut into it today or tomorrow. I also subbed out some bread flour for rye as I have two three pound bags to use up. I made two 800g sandwich loaves and some 120g rolls. Violet had a friend over so I gave them a loaf. I've been trying to time my baking using a leave-in temp probe which has worked fine up until now. But it went to 209 and stayed there. I usually pull my loaves at 210-212. I realized it had been baking a long time with no alarm so I used a different probe and it was at 215. Not sure what was wrong. So the loaves are a little burned on top.

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[aaronatthedoublef]

Thanks BA for the KAB info. I'll check online for their white whole wheat and see. The only places I can find it now only have organic and it is north of $15/5lbs which is too rich for my blood.

Mike, I'll be interested to see how your bread comes out. I was trying to do things just like the recipe so I made a boule. I'll be interested to see what your results are. I wish I had two kits so I could do the first following the steps and the second with extra stretching, etc.

The taste is good. It changed the second day. It's more sour today than yesterday.

[aaronatthedoublef]

Judging by what I see on Instagram those who are doing baking without a mix are going in the opposite direction of ATK - super simplicity. I was a huge fan of Cook's Illustrated when it first came out and while I learned from them everything was always many steps, very fussy, and not really approachable for this newbie. I still have the first two or three Cook's annuals.

But then they became a thing. And started selling the same recipes six different ways. And while they still "don't accept advertising" they recommend products based on testing but also have click-through to Amazon where they make money if I buy something.

I always feel bad for people who lose their jobs in a big layoff but the world changed and they did not.

[aaronatthedoublef]

Here is my einkorn boule.

It was a mix of flours that were AP, einkorn, and whole wheat. I wish I had taken a picture of the mix to show you but I forgot to do that. It's from local farmers and a local miller making stone ground flour.

The dough was very slack. I added a second stretch/fold and I probably could have used a third. Also, the recipe called for warm rises which I don't usually do. I did this time because I was testing this and wanted to follow instructions. When I shaped my boule I probably could have used a few more turns to tighten it up as well.

My second proof as a boule was in a bowl that was way too small and I probably used too little flour. I've made boules before final shaping but I don't make boules for my final product because for me batards and loaf pans are easier to make sandwiches with. The dough stuck to the towel even though I used a lot of flour. So it was either the bowl was too small, not enough flour, or both. I did salvage most of the dough and plopped it onto the stone.

The taste and flavor were nice. Based on this recipe I may try using a little less starter in my own sandwich loaves to see how it affects taste.

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[aaronatthedoublef]

Back in the old days (20 years ago when we live in SoCal) produce in grocery stores was picked before it was ripe, bulk shipped to Texas, the processed and packaged and shipped around the country, including back to CA. So all the stuff in the grocery stores was sub-par and we always shopped at farmers markets.

At least according to the farmers. I don't know if that was true then and if it is true today. All I know is local produce at stores was terrible compared to farmers markets back then.

If someone can check an Ald's in CA it will have a label that lists all the ingredients and probably a Prop 65 warning too.

[aaronatthedoublef]

Choco, Lemon Oatmeal Sugar Cookies sound great. Did you scoop the dough into individual cookies or as on piece of dough?

BA, I quit making pancakes as my kids complained they tasted "too healthy". They still had butter and some white flour but also whole wheat and flax meal. They like restaurant pancakes. I supposed I could buy some malt and see if that makes a difference. Whose white whole wheat do you use? Where do you buy it?

I am trying a few things this week. I am testing a flour mix someone at the BBGA is trying. I mostly want to see what einkorn flour is like without buying a two pound bag for $12 or something like that. I don't like the way the recipe is written. First the website needs higher contrast and it's written in chunky paragraphs that are hard for me to follow. I've already screwed it up by not doing the intial rise in the mixing bow but that should be okay. The recipe is password protected so I'll see if I can get persmission to share it.

Next, I've always wanted to try using old dough. So I dumped 200g of old pizza dough into my new pizza dough this week. I thought it would be hard to mix in but it wasn't. The total batch of dough is 2600g so I am not sure if 200g is enough to make any difference. I chopped up the old dough and let it sit in my water while I put together my dry ingredients. I dumped the water mix into the dry and mixed everything as usual. I may try a bigger amount of old dough next time.

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