Beatrice Ojakangas “Norwegain Coffee Buns” HELP!

Home Forums Baking — Breads and Rolls Beatrice Ojakangas “Norwegain Coffee Buns” HELP!

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  • #4712
    BakerAunt
    Participant

      I baked the "Norwegian Coffee Buns," from The Great Scandinavian Baking Book (Little Brown, 1988), p. 95, on Saturday evening into early Sunday morning. I needed a quantity sweet roll recipe that would make 2 dozen for a last-minute announced breakfast event at my church on Sunday morning. I chose this one from the coffee bread section because it made 2 dozen, and it did not require the 4 hour or overnight refrigeration of dough before shaping and the second rise.

      Here are the ingredients:
      2 packages active dried yeast (I reduced to 4 tsp. from that 4 1/2 tsp.)
      1 cup warm water (105-115F; I used 110F)
      1/2 cup sugar
      1 tsp. salt
      1/2 cup melted butter. (I melted a 4 oz. stick), cooled
      1 tsp pulverized cardamom seed. (I crush with a mortar and pestle; I used 3/4 tsp.)
      2 cups milk, scalded and cooled to lukewarm (I used 2 cups buttermilk and did not heat it.)
      6-6 1/2 cups flour (I used KAF AP, and ended up using 7 cups)

      I used my Cuisinart 7-qt. stand mixer. I proofed the yeast as directed, then I added the rest of the sugar, the cardamom seed, the buttermilk, and the melted butter. (I held out the salt, which she added here.) I mixed in 4 cups of flour, using the flat paddle. Then I let it sit covered for 15 minutes. (She actually mixed in 3 cups of the flour, then the rest until the mixture would not absorb any more flour, and then let it stand 15 minutes.) I changed to the kneading spiral, then mixed in the 2 cups of flour combined with the salt. I quickly realized that would not be enough and added the "extra" 1/2 cup, then put in yet another cup. I went ahead and kneaded it for 4 minutes at a speed of 3. It was still pretty sticky, but I figured it would absorb more in the first rise.

      I let it rise for an hour, and it certainly did! When I punched it down, it was clearly still a rather sticky--as in all over the hands!--dough. She said to turn it out onto an oiled surface, divide into 24 pieces, and shape "into smooth balls." It was a challenge to weigh out the dough to get even balls, and even with damp fingertips, it was not possible to shape them into balls. I did not use an oiled surface but my silicone mat. I would get them into the best half-rounded shape I could, then use my scraper to plop them on parchment-lined cookie sheets. The second rise was supposed to be 45 minutes, but I only let it go for almost 30 minutes before brushing them with a slightly beaten egg and 2 Tbs. milk (1 %), and sprinkling with pearled sugar. They bake at 375F and had nice oven spring, but they did spread more than I would like to see--and ran together a bit. (Next time, I will use my wide Reynolds parchment.) I baked for 17 minutes rather than the given 15 minutes, since I use heavy cookie sheets that require this adjustment.

      This morning, my husband and I did Quality Control on one. They have a lovely, airy texture, and wonderful taste (3/4 tsp. of cardamom was enough), so I took them to my church function, and they got rave reviews. Only two returned home with me. People want the recipe. I had to tell them that it is a very difficult dough to work with (one lady of Norwegian ancestry said that she has a sweet bread recipe that if you are not silently cussing to yourself while shaping it, you are doing it wrong), and I'm not sure that I'd try it without a stand mixer. I told them that I'd like to tweak it and try it again before passing it on. (Only one of these people is somewhat of a serious baker.)

      If you have suggestions about this recipe, I'd like to hear them. Beatrice Ojakangas does not give detailed instructions on kneading or on handling such a wet dough, nor does she specify what kind of flour she uses, other than an AP flour with a protein of 11-12 grams per cup. Should I add more flour--perhaps bring it up to 7 1/2 cups or 8? Is the issue that I need to find some tutorial on working with a rather slack/sticky dough? I do have a note on another coffee bread recipe in this section that I tried a long time ago that the dough when shaped was so sticky that I really had to flour my surface to shape them, and even then, I recall having some difficulty. (This was before I had a stand mixer or a silicone mat. I've come a long way.)

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      • This topic was modified 8 years, 3 months ago by BakerAunt.
      #4716
      cwcdesign
      Participant

        You could try bread flour instead of AP. I think there might be some tutorials on YouTube for working with really slack doughs.

        #4719
        BakerAunt
        Participant

          I'll see what I can find on YouTube. I don't want to use bread flour, since she says that it will make the pastry less tender, and cautions against using it unless the recipe specifies to do so.

          BTW--the buns were definitely superior on the first day. There was a drop off in texture and taste when I ate most of the last two on Monday morning. (My husband also sampled a piece and agreed.)

          Beatrice Ojakangas does have a WordPress site, so I have posted a question there. The last post was a couple of years ago, so I do not know if there will be an answer, but I will let everyone know if there is.

          • This reply was modified 8 years, 3 months ago by BakerAunt.
          #4726
          BakerAunt
          Participant

            In the meantime, I decided to google Hveteboller. Of course, almost all the entries are in Norwegian, but I did find this one:

            http://thenewartofbaking.blogspot.com/2013/02/hveteboller-norwegian-cardamom-sweet.html

            It is close to the one I made (mine made double the amount). The big difference is in the liquid. 2 3/4 cups, as opposed to 3 cups, and it used half bread flour and half AP. She also mixes by hand, and did a short first rise.

            Mine clearly had too much liquid, so I will cut back next time.

            #4742
            BakerAunt
            Participant

              I heard from Cass (Kid Pizza) about this recipe. I'll cut and paste here what he wrote:

              Good Morning Marliss.

              I hope this note finds you well. Yes Marliss, your recipe has too much Hydration in it. About 85% worth. This is my correction for you:

              Assume 6 1/4 cups of flour (29, oz), this is 69% hydration. Use 2,1/2 cups of water.

              Marliss, you really do not need to proof the package yeast. This procedure was done many years ago because QC wasn't up to like it is today. There really ever is a failure in today's yeast manu.

              Sooo, just add the yeast into the mix like you have done many times before with instant yeast. Use room temp water NOT HOT WATER.. Yes Marliss you can reduce the yeast slightly more to 3/8ths oz (3 tsp worth of package yeast or 3.5 tsp of instant yeast if you like.

              Marliss the reason there is a lot of yeast in this recipe is because THERE IS A LOT OF SUGAR in IT !!! You can reduce it somewhat like 1 TBLS worth after measuring out 1/2 cup (3.5,oz)

              I have other suggestions if you like such as reducing the sugar further & adding honey, etc. post back if interested with your next results.

              Enjoy the day Marliss.
              ~CASS.

              I'm glad to hear that I'm on the right track! I will try the recipe again--perhaps not for a few weeks--and I will post back the results. I may also try the high sugar yeast (and use just 2 tsp. of it), since I have it in the freezer and might as well use it.

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