Kitchen remodel

[aaronatthedoublef]

Hello,

We're starting a kitchen remodel which will include all new appliances including our range. We're dropping way down in size from our current 64 inch/10 burner (it's a long story) to a 48 inch (probably) and we're looking at dual fuel or an induction cook top. All our cookware is stainless or cast iron so they should all work. Any thoughts and/or recommendations? Kate wants something easy to clean so I've said even if we get gas we'll need sealed burners. I also have adjusted our ovens to bake at higher temps than on the dial so one of them hits 600 even though it says 500. I don't think I'll be able to do this with an electric oven.

Also, we'll likely buy a new mixer. BA - how do you like your Ank? What is the learning curve and how well does it work for cakes and cookies. Or should I buy a larger planetary mixer - currently we have a 5 qt KA and we could go up to 8 qt without braking the budget. I want something that will handle five, six, or seven pounds of bread dough but also cookies and cakes.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

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[Mike Nolan]

Stainless steel pans are not always compatible with induction, if a magnet sticks to the bottom, you're good.

If you're redoing cabinets, we did two things with all of our lower cabinets. First, the shelves all pull out. Second, there's a drawer at the top of every cabinet and it has a pullout surface that you can use as extra counter space for unloading groceries, as a work surface, etc. The countertops on the lower cabinets are at several different heights, since my wife is shorter than I am. Some of the countertops are butcher block, some are granite. One thing I wish we had was a stainless steel countertop next to a sink for easy cleanup when you do something messy, like cut up a chicken.

[aaronatthedoublef]

Mike - thanks for the magnet test. Our popcorn popper and our All Clad both say they are induction compatible but neither will hold a magnet. Looking deeper into All Clad, they added a magnetic layer in 2025 to be induction compatible. Our pans were a wedding present and are 25 years old and that was before induction became popular.

We are redoing cabinets and thanks for the tip about drawers. We'll definitely do that. The pullout surface is a good idea too. We don't really have a ton of counter space and that might be a nice way to add more.

Our island is finished butcher block (not sure why the builder did that) and we're swapping that for unfinished butcher block. We have granite counter tops now and we are trying to figure out what to replace those with. We're thinking about soap stone. Some stainless would be nice.

[Mike Nolan]

My basic rule of kitchen design is you can never have too many drawers. Making sure you have space for multiple people to move around, even with drawers (or the dishwasher) open is also key, There's 45 inches of space between the center island and the counters on either side of it.

Yes, this is a big kitchen 17x18 if I remember right.

Also our lower cabinets are a full 30 inches deep (countertop edge to wall)
and the upper cabinets have an interior depth of 14 inches.

[cwcdesign]

Aaron, I'll reiterate what Mike said about the Magnet test. I had my 40 yo Cuisinart flat bottomed pans so I thought they would work when I got my induction stove. No such luck. But I was fortunate that Williams-Sonoma was having a crazy sale on a 16 piece set of the same pans (lids and pans) which was comparable to the set I had accumulated - it was something like $250, as I said crazy, but they're great.

Ditto drawers on the bottom and my cabinet maker insisted on a super lazy Susan in a lower cabinet which has a right angle cutout and snaps into place.

[BakerAunt]

Aaron--Williams Sonoma sells a version of the crank popcorn popper that is induction compatible. I know because several years ago, I bought a Whirley Pop for my sister and nieces, then had to have them send it back for a Whirley Pop that is induction compatible. The advice I gave my bonus daughter and her fiancé on cookware is to buy cookware that will work on an induction stovetop, even if that is not what they have now because induction is likely the future.

[aaronatthedoublef]

Thanks all. Our current cabinets are a mixture. Out pantry cabinet and floor level cabinets all have drawers. Our above counter cabinets are shelves. I don't think I want drawers above the counter. My wife is set on cabinets that go all the way to the ceiling but given that I am the tallest one in the house at 5'7" I think that things on the top shelves will go there and never be used.

I love the drawer/counter mixture. Our kitchen is deceptively small. It takes up two rooms but we really only work in one. We're going to put some things in the working part of the kitchen into the eating part of the kitchen. That will give us more storage and workspace in the working part of the kitchen.

I have used the magnet test and then checked about All Clad on the internet. At first glance it says they are induction compatible and they are NOW. All Clad added a magnetic plate to them in 2025. Since ours were wedding gifts they date back to 2001 and are not magnetic. I found out Kate was confusing induction with convection so I did some disambiguation. Lots of people are freaking out about gas. I grew up with it and with pilot lights so I guess I don't notice the smell. Also, houses these days are sealed a lot tighter than my parents house so the smell is more noticeable. I still want a gas cook top and will settle for an electric oven. All the bakeries I know have put them in and swear by them. Things have obviously improved since I worked on the 50 year old electric oven in the bakery in Seattle. We'll probably go with a Wolf since they are the most common and easiest to have serviced. I still want to be able to adjust the oven myself so I'll look for that.

BA - I still want to know about your experience with the Ank. Do you use it for bread? Cakes and cookies? How does it work for larger batches?

Thanks again

[BakerAunt]

With cabinets, be sure to know what you are getting and to measure. My Franciscan ware Desert Rose plates are too wide for the shelves in our cabinets. As I had never had that issue any where I lived before, it never occurred to me to go in with tape measure and measurements of my dishes. I did not go for pull out drawers in the lower cabinets only because I was expecting FULL shelves, but modern cabinets only have half second shelves. We put in two large utility cabinets to use for the pantry, but I did not realize how deep they are or that they only allowed for three shelves on the bottom and one on the top. They are too deep, and the shelves too far apart to be as useful as they need to be. And of course, I have had the problem of shelves in the utility cabinets collapsing because it did not occur to the designers that I would be putting a lot of stuff on them. Scott and I are currently trying to work out how to modify them. If I had had my druthers, and the space, I would have preferred open shelving in that back area, or better yet, I would have loved a walk-in pantry, because where we live, the big grocery runs happen only every three or four weeks.

[BakerAunt]

Aaron--I am still learning to use the Ankursrum, which I have had for less than a month. So far, I really like it for my three-loaves batches of bread. I use the dough knife and dough rollers. A dough hook is included, but it is suggested only for heavy bread or making mincemeat. I find that I use less flour in recipes with this mixer than with my Cuisinart stand mixer--and with it, I used less flour than when I kneaded by hand. I also give it high marks for making Sourdough Cracker dough.

I have not yet tried mixing cookie dough. Their recipes call for using the second plastic bowl that comes with it and is affixed over a central post. There is a "cookie whisk" attachment that comes with the mixer to use. Butter must be very soft. There is also a balloon whisk attachment that came with it.

I'm not so sure this mixer would work well for making frosting. That would be a reason to keep a small Kitchen Aid around.

I'm hoping to try cookies and a cake in the next week. Maybe I should start an "Adventures with the Ankarsrum thread?

[Mike Nolan]

Maybe I should start an "Adventures with the Ankarsrum" thread?

Good idea!

Two things I'd be interested in are how well it works on very small batches and what the practical upper limit is on a batch. I know when I'd make Paddy's Double Crusty recipe in my 4.5Q KA, it'd come awful close to spilling out of the bowl.

Occasionally I have a need to make a 3X or 4X batch of challah dough, even a 2X of the recipe I use most (in BBA) has been know to climb up all the way up the dough hook.

Last Easter I tried to make a double batch of Hot Cross Buns, I wound up splitting it once it was fully mixed together.

[BakerAunt]

Ok, I will start such a thread, under Discussions, probably tomorrow. I will also post my Whole Wheat Oat Bran Bread recipe, as that will allow people to compare the amount of flour in my three loaves. My thought is that the Ankarsrum should handle a double recipe of Paddy's bread with ease.

[aaronatthedoublef]

Thanks all! Good tips. We're working with an architect who does design that we've known almost since we moved here. She is also a mom who has prepared meals for a family of five so that meets one of my main criteria. I am tired of designers who don't cook telling me how a kitchen should look and function. I won't subject you to my full rant on that topic. Suffice it to say, I have the whole appliance garage concept that is being forced on me. I am getting a kitchen clock back after all these years! Hooray for simple pleasures.

We also know the cabinet maker they are recommending and she built some cabinets for us years ago. We ran into BAs problem where our dishes did not really fit in the cabinet so I understand that too and we'll try to account for that.

We're looking to replace the granite with soap stone. I do not like granite because, being color blind, things tend to be camouflaged when I spill them. Some stainless would be nice too but that may not be in the budget.

I think I will steer away from an Ank as it will be too challenging to us. I'll have a big stand mixer (8 or 10qt) and my 5qt. The bowl comes loose on my 5qt now and I am not sure if it is the threads on the bowl or on the mixer. I brace it against the stand and that helps but it still is loose and jiggles and is noisy. I think I have another bowl I can test with.

The contractor has recommended a local appliance dealer that I loathe. He has had nothing but good experiences with them but I've had horrible after sales service from them after buying our current, very expensive, range. They did not have a professional installed set it up so we ended up with scratched floors and a hole drilled through kitchen floor and connected to an outlet in the basement with extension cord. When things malfunction and need repair they offer no service and I had to find someone to fix it on my own which was VERY challenging. Add to this the brand is unresponsive and will not allow me to order parts and repair it myself and I'm pretty down on the people who sold this to me.

Thanks everyone for all your thoughts.

[Mike Nolan]

IMHO the 'work triangle' concept is either flawed or poorly executed in many kitchens.

I tend to think in terms of heat flow and wet/dry. Items that are designed to generate heat should not be very close to items that are designed to generate cold. Dry ingredients should not be stored near things that produce heat (by design or as a byproduct, like a dishwasher) or that use water.

I may still have a block diagram of our kitchen, if so I'll see if I can post it. Several chefs who have worked in it (catering events) have said it was very well designed for working efficiently.

[skeptic7]

Was the work triangle suppose to be range -- refrigerator -- sink? I think that utensil/silverware drawer needs to be handy for almost everything. Mix -- get a new spoon, fry -- get different spatula, while refrigerator and sink doesn't need to be as often available.

[Mike Nolan]

In our kitchen, which is 17 x 18 with a center island, the gas range/electric oven is on the west wall and the refrigerator/freezer are on the east wall. There's a prep sink on south side of the island, an electric cooktop on the north side and the cleanup sink and dishwasher are on the north wall. The south, west and north walls and island areas that don't have appliances all have counter space. There's also a two-drawer under-cabinet refrigerator to the right of the prep sink for fruits and veggies.

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